Building a Bullit vs. importing...

[R_Beckhaus]

Scollist, My mistake. I thought it was the company offering turn key brand new cars using dynacorn shells, with no original mustang parts at all. They were 70K or thereabouts. This was a topic of some discussion a few years ago and the big question is would it actually be a mustang or a look a like. I think it was Blue Oval Garages at the time. Muscle car factory appear to be repairing original shells with dynacorn parts? in whisc case no dramas, but you cannot have a totally new production 1967 mustang and call it a real 1967 mustang.
Cheers, Ron B

[scollist]

Scollist, My mistake. I thought it was the company offering turn key brand new cars using dynacorn shells, with no original mustang parts at all. They were 70K or thereabouts

Hi Ron,

Yes I think they do offer turn-key for that price. But they also offer the shells with ADR compliance bits for 'under 30k'. And no I don't think they are repairing old shells for this product. See this article from Unique Cars http://www.tradeuniquecars.com.au/features/1506/muscle-car-factory-melbourne-profile/. And the Products|Dynacorn Classic Bodies' tab on http://www.musclecarfactory.com.au/products.php.

There is a picture in the rotation that shows old shells, but I think they use those for bespoke builds.  I suspect that if Mungus goes down the new shell path it would have to have a 'new' motor - i.e. Fuel injection etc. to meet ADR emissions, among many other issues. I'm not sure if this is what he is planning given he wants a Bullitt but is prepared to 'compromise' on the underneath bits.

Cheers, Shane

[R_Beckhaus]

I'm sure somewhere he discussed RRS suspension and a 390. A 390 crate motor with holley fuel injectors would be a viable set up for ADR, wouldn't it, so long as cat converters and emission control devices were installed?

[mungus]

Back again;

Yes I'm fitting a mildly modded FE390 4v motor and TKO 600 box.
Haven't made the FE390 since 1976 so I doubt there's any crate motors available.
Are you perhaps thinking of the 393 (stroked 351)?

I have no interest in going the ADR route BTW. Would bugger what I'm trying to achieve.

Thanks anyway. All views welcomed.

[SXTY8]

What I meant by my earlier post was that if I was buying a car for the pleasure of driving it, I would have the modifications that I described earlier.
While I wouldn't consider changing my car as it's a factory 390, any car that I intended working on would have to be a stroked small block. They put out as much power but have so much more room under the bonnet.

[BAC]

No doubt you've seen this one and it's neither a v8 nor manual, but it looks to have quite a lot to work with and the price is reasonable so far:

www.ebay.com.au/itm/221804376698

[mungus]

Thanks Brian,

Indeed I have seen that one, but all suggestions are appreciated.

It suffers the same downsides as some others, in that I am paying for a better car but the "better" parts that up its value are pretty much worthless to me, as I'll be changing or junking them.
In this case it's; wrong colour, engine, trans, interior and condition not as good as I want. Hence why I'd prefer a junker that gives me an OZ legal fastback V8 manual ID for minimum money.

The only other one on offer now that I'm interested in is a tatty 1967 S code fastback that's minus its motor and trans and needs some body work. It's in way better condition than the one I'm bidding on but then it's also double the money. I like that it's an S and the motor and trans is no issue as I'm going Tremec and have sourced a correct 390 nearby. If the auction I'm in on now yields nada I may make the other bloke an offer...

[peter9231]

Somebody couldn't wait so they changed an XP

[66 Stang]

That looks seriously wrong.

[mungus]

Wrong would be putting it politely!

Meantime I've decided to cool my heels and won't be buying the red rust bucket on flea bay.
East coast shipping plus probable AQIS cleaning etc means around $4.5+ AUD just for shipping.

I'll be keeping my eye out for any good west coast deals or maybe if I'm lucky, something local.
Thanks for all the good advice. I'm all primed and ready to go when the right one appears!

 

[peter9231]

I bet you are looking for an XP now.

[67FBGT]

Well if you do go back to looking in the USA then IMO you don't want anything from the east in any case, that's where the majority of the rusty ones will be due to the climate. And plenty of rusty ones come from up Dearborn way too.
Sure there are no doubt plenty of exceptions - cars moved backwards & forwards across the USA for lots of reasons - but my advice & in part from seeing many dozens of Mustangs imported by a friend who was back then in the business of sourcing cars for people - both complete running or dismantled projects - is to stick to the dry states as a car's origin as a best starting point, as he did. We saw plenty of rusty disasters from other parts of the USA imported by people who didn't take that approach. Some were just too far gone to be viable.
Believe me, you do NOT want a rusty old Ford just because it's cheap as you will find that the rust problems go right through all the body shell as there were so many areas that never received any primer at all let alone paint & there was no factory rust protection to the shells whatsoever, they were thrown together in a big hurry due to demand & sent out the door. They are monocoque construction so there are rust traps all through them. They were not hand built with care let alone any thought as to longevity, & certainly not expected to last this long (50 yrs now).
I'm not doubting your skills, perseverance & determination for a moment. But, IMO no matter how good your skills are a rusty shell will take you years to work through, repair properly & correctly for safety, & put all to rights so it drives well, much pain, & many $$$.
Buy a good car to start with & you will be better off & the end point will be in sight that you can look forward to rather than quite some years away.

[StephenSLR]

you don't want anything from the east in any case, that's where the majority of the rusty ones will be due to the climate.

Even more so due to them salting the roads when it snowed. Yes there are exceptions, many did have climate controlled garages and the true car lovers wouldn't take their cars out during winter, of course many just used these cars to get from A to B and parked them out front. North east USA is known as the 'rust belt' mainly due to the declining heavy industry but also due to rusty cars.

Similarly you'll find rust buckets on the west coast if the owners lived close to the beaches with all that salt air blowing in.

Best advice is to have it inspected; don't go off factory location.

s

[67FBGT]

Yes, all very true. Cars could have been anywhere in their lifetime, & alternately cared for or abused.
However an origin of being from the west factory, & dry state delivery location (DSO), is at least a worthy starting point.

[mungus]

I bet you are looking for an XP now.

Ha! The only I'd have a use for an XP for would be as a target on my rifle range...   

[mungus]

Well the auction has ended and the red rust bucket sold for $7,450. So I wouldn't have won it anyway.
(My top bid was $6,600). It just goes to show what any genuine 67' fastback V8 manual project is worth these days, even in that sort of state. Given how many get restored and sold for biggish money I'm not entirely surprised. A competent US based Mustang workshop will have her good as new and still turn a profit.

But I do agree with many of the comments here. 

However in reality if it wasn't for the USD FX hike of recent months, and the high east coast shipping costs it might still have been a goer for me. 

Yes it was very rusty (done that before as I mostly do pre war or 1950's cars), but as I was going to put a RHD kit in that wasn't so important to me given how much structural steel gets replaced in that process. I was also fitting new rear quarters as I was making it a 1968 replica with the rectangular side strip reflectors, and I wouldn't bother putting that work into a rusty old quarter panel. (Bullit replica job remember). Plus as I always sandblast and rotisserie my cars I would be willing to bet a lot of so called "better" cars would have revealed plenty of "work" to be fixed. (From past experience). In reality most of my car bodies end up getting largely replaced with new steel so its more a case of do I want the hassle and time.  If I won lotto then no I don't, I'd probably just find a shitty S code fastback stateside and pay someone good to do what I want...

But sadly despite many attempts, the lotto still eludes me! 

[StephenSLR]

It just goes to show what any genuine 67' fastback V8 manual project is worth these days, even in that sort of state.

... and in that particular state in the USA. Location definitely plays a part in pricing. You'll find cars in regional areas fetch less due to transport; many people don't bother driving hours to check out what could be a rust bucket.

s

[SXTY8]

I reckon it's hard enough finding a genuine 67/68 S code fastback, looking for a manual car even more so.
I think I'd buy a good auto and convert it to manual. End of problem!   

[67FBGT]

looking for a manual car even more so.

Good point & too true. Eg. Only something like about 7% of '67/68 cars had 4-speed manual trans. There were far more of the 3-speeds - I don't recall the percentage - but they were very often low spec'd entry level cars as the 3 speed was the base trans.
By '67 the majority of the cars being ordered were to have auto. So yes by specifying a manual up front you are limiting your options when in reality you won't want to reuse most of the mechanicals anyway.

[BAC]

To get it cheap, I think you may need to compromise on the spec of the rust bucket.  A 6cyl auto is going to be easier to get for the price you want than an S code.

Seeing as how you're going to fit your own motor and gearbox anyway, the only downside is the completed spec not matching the VIN.  But then again, you're planning to fit a 5 speed anyway so why pay $$$ more for a 'correct' VIN?

[67FBGT]

Good point from BAC.
I agree, you might as well consider any engine code which comes up, as no matter what engine code & spec it left the factory in, your finished car won't match in many if not most respects mechanically & aesthetically - a 'Bullitt' looking car colour-wise but very different mechanically. You're going to build a special you said not build an exact Bullitt replica as was custom built for Chad McQueen.
Chances are the 390 you get from somewhere to install wouldn't have the right casting date period for the car's build date if you did manage to purchase an S code car, so no matter what engine code is in the VIN it would only be academic really would it not?

[StephenSLR]

I agree, you might as well consider any engine code which comes up

Totally; if it's a ground up resto and he's not building it concours then who really cares as long as it passes engineering. A good Bullitt replica would fetch good money and he wouldn't be denying an original 390 from being restored to factory spec.

s

[mungus]

No offence intended, but some here aren't taking much notice of my earlier posts...
I've made it plain more than once that I don't especially care what the vehicle comes with as long as it's a 67' / 68' fastback.

Nice if it was a V8 manual but that's no big deal as I'm changing both those bits. Just makes it a little less divergent from the final product. What matters is that it's a repairable 1967 / 1968 fastback with useable ID. Location is obviously important also.

Also Chad McQueen's car is not an exact replica of his Dad's movie cars.
It doesn't have a FE390 4v and the wheels are bigger, etc.
it's a damn nice car and from a distance it looks like a Bullit movie car, but on closer examination it really isn't. 

The only mention I've made of wanting an S code was if I won lotto and could afford to buy an S code and get someone to fix it / do the build for me.... 

[BAC]

No offence intended, but some here aren't taking much notice of my earlier posts...
I've made it plain more than once that I don't especially care what the vehicle comes with as long as it's a 67' / 68' fastback.

None taken, but you have changed your tune just a little.  Here's what you had to say when I linked to a 6cyl auto on Ebay:

In this case it's; wrong colour, engine, trans, interior and condition not as good as I want. Hence why I'd prefer a junker that gives me an OZ legal fastback V8 manual ID for minimum money.

No matter either way, just helps us to help you if we know which way you're headed... 

[mungus]

Here's one story to add to the mix!

I called RRS to ask if it's true that they have way to use a Dynacorn shell with an old ID tag. The man I was told to ask for was away so I asked the lady if she knew anything about that idea. I was told a few "interesting" things; 

1. The Dynacorn shells sold as RHD in the states can't be Dynacorn because RRS can't buy them like that, they fit the RHD kit in OZ... In fact you apparently can't buy Dynacorn shells at all, only a collection of panels which RRS align etc.
(Mmmm I thought, RRS must be very special given that several U.S. resellers offer RHD shells).

2. Even better she told me if I restored my own original 68' rust bucket using their parts that I HAD TO FIT AN EMMISSIONS CONPLIANT (ADR) engine!
I reminded her this was NOT a new build car from RRS but the restoration of an original 1968 car and she repeated - NO YOU CANT IN KNOW YOU CANT REGISTER ANY MUSTANG WITHOUT A EMMISIONS APPROVED ENGINE!

I can only hope she's the office lady! Think I'll call back later when the boys are home.