Do you have to degree a new cam ?

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Author Topic: Do you have to degree a new cam ?  (Read 482699 times)

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #750 on: March 26, 2016, 02:58:39 pm »
.

hey, that's a nice cam, who suggested that one?

set them .002" TIGHTER than they suggest.

 :lmao:

Worked it out with my years of mechanical experience...  :thumb:


The centre screws are all backed out till they lightly seated.

Now, 1 full turn down feels pretty tight. Is this right ?

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #751 on: March 26, 2016, 03:06:04 pm »
:lmao:

Worked it out with my years of mechanical experience...  :thumb:


The centre screws are all backed out till they lightly seated.

Now, 1 full turn down feels pretty tight. Is this right ?

no fn idea what you are talking about.

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #752 on: March 26, 2016, 03:07:05 pm »
put the feeler gauge between the rocker and valve

tighten screw until it requires a slight force to remove the gauge

hold the screw as you tighten the nut.

recheck the clearance.

the adjustment needs to be very close but not 110% perfect .001" off is ok.

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #753 on: March 26, 2016, 03:11:26 pm »
put the feeler gauge between the rocker and valve

tighten screw until it requires a slight force to remove the gauge

hold the screw as you tighten the nut.

recheck the clearance.

the adjustment needs to be very close but not 110% perfect .001" off is ok.

Ok,

If i torque the shafts down to the stand there is absolutely no way i'm getting a feeler gauge in there at all, screws are backed out and the rod has zero play in it.

As soon as there torqued down, everything is tight.

I'm over it today...  :smile01: :smile01:  :thud:

« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 03:20:51 pm by Fitzy1980 »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #754 on: March 26, 2016, 03:22:47 pm »
ok, look at how high the cross bar on the lifters is for number 1.

rotate the crank two full revolutions.

watch the lifters to see if they go any lower during this time.

when the lifters get to the highest point, look closely at them to see if you can see the oil band protruding above the lifter boss.


POST SOME PHOTOS FROM A FEW FEET AWAY.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 03:28:04 pm by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #755 on: March 26, 2016, 03:35:02 pm »
ok, look at how high the cross bar on the lifters is for number 1.

rotate the crank two full revolutions.

watch the lifters to see if they go any lower during this time.

I just watched no 1, no they don't go any lower than where they are at TDC

when the lifters get to the highest point, look closely at them to see if you can see the oil band protruding above the lifter boss.

POST SOME PHOTOS FROM A FEW FEET AWAY.

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« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 03:52:41 pm by Fitzy1980 »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #756 on: March 26, 2016, 03:40:03 pm »
i need a photo of the assembly with the rocker and push rods.

rotate the crank and check the lifter first
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 03:41:50 pm by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #757 on: March 26, 2016, 04:34:31 pm »
Im getting the feeling something maybe very wrong here...

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #758 on: March 26, 2016, 05:12:03 pm »
Im getting the feeling something maybe very wrong here...

its impossible for something to be very wrong.

did you rotate the crank twice.

everything looks perfectly fine to me so i see no reason for you to not hve clearance.

did you turn the adjuster screws COUNTER CLOCKWISE to loosen them?




Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #759 on: March 26, 2016, 05:20:48 pm »
its impossible for something to be very wrong.

did you rotate the crank twice.

everything looks perfectly fine to me so i see no reason for you to not hve clearance.

did you turn the adjuster screws COUNTER CLOCKWISE to loosen them?

Rotated it twice.

Yes, they are wound all the way out till they stop. Don't think i can turn them any further, should i be able to ?

Even if i finger tighten the shaft down, i can rotate the push rod in my fingers but there is zero clearance between the rocker tip and the spring..

If i then torque them down, the whole lot is tight.

The only way i can get a feeler gauge under is to have the shaft nuts slightly loose. Which i assume isn't right

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #760 on: March 26, 2016, 05:23:28 pm »
 :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Great, more parts.

Are we able to compare the specs between the Schnausage and the Howards re push rods ?

Push rods are

6.950 .080 Trend 210


I forgot to ask to, with the push rods which end is which ?

One end is slightly larger than the other
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 05:26:28 pm by Fitzy1980 »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #761 on: March 26, 2016, 05:29:48 pm »
ok, remove a one screw from a loose rocker and see how far it looks like it will g into the rocker before it stops . make sure the screws are as loose as they can be.

the only other thing it can be is that your other cam was a small base circle cam which it should not have been but who the fk knows.

can you post a close up photo of your other cam.


Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #762 on: March 26, 2016, 05:30:59 pm »
:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Great, more parts.

Are we able to compare the specs between the Schnausage and the Howards re push rods ?

Push rods are

6.950 .080 Trend 210


I forgot to ask to, with the push rods which end is which ?

One end is slightly larger than the other

i need a photo of the rods.

what a f'n pita.

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #763 on: March 26, 2016, 05:34:00 pm »
:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Great, more parts.

Are we able to compare the specs between the Schnausage and the Howards re push rods ?

Push rods are

6.950 .080 Trend 210


I forgot to ask to, with the push rods which end is which ?

One end is slightly larger than the other
Unless the cam base circle is wrong the rods should not be too long, but as you dont have an adjustable checking rod and some light checking springs you cant check. are you sure the adjusters are all the way out. You dont just buy rods you work out the length first, they are made in 50 thou increments

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #764 on: March 26, 2016, 05:36:07 pm »
i need a photo of the rods.

what a f'n pita.

Tell me about it.

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« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 05:42:51 pm by Fitzy1980 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #765 on: March 26, 2016, 05:48:35 pm »
I had a crack at google and from what i can see the Howards cam has a small base circle

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #766 on: March 26, 2016, 05:53:18 pm »
I had a crack at google and from what i can see the Howards cam has a small base circle

stop googling


Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #767 on: March 26, 2016, 05:54:16 pm »
can you measure the smallest part of a lobe on your old cam

your snausage looks like a small base circle cam.

the howards is a big fat cam
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 06:03:49 pm by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #768 on: March 26, 2016, 06:05:23 pm »
can you measure the smallest part of a lobe on your old cam

your snausage looks like a small base circle cam.

the howards is a big fat cam

You mean the base of the lobe ?

How do you want it measured ?

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #769 on: March 26, 2016, 06:13:25 pm »
You mean the base of the lobe ?

How do you want it measured ?

the lobe is tall in one direction and small in another . measure the small part of the snausage . you should have practice doing that.

measure how long your push rod is.

you need to buy one of these .

http://www.vpw.com.au/Category/Index/551749
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 06:15:58 pm by barnett468 »

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #770 on: March 26, 2016, 06:19:57 pm »
The original cam looks like a SADI blank I would have thought an engine of this caliber they would have used steel billet. This is why the gear failed I reckon. They dont like a bronze gear. If  the base circle is different you are starting to get in deeper with respect to working out rod length.
Building high performance engines is not for the faint hearted. I think you should have left it alone. I do have pictures of working out rod lengths if you need them. But you'll need to swap out 2 valve springs and get a checking rod.

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #771 on: March 26, 2016, 06:23:19 pm »
If i've gotta go through this push rod shite, it will stay there until i can pay  a shop to do it.

Thing owes me over $50k and it comes undone for what amounts to someone cutting  corners for the sake of it.

Just one thing after another..

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #772 on: March 26, 2016, 06:26:46 pm »
If i've gotta go through this push rod shite, it will stay there until i can pay  a shop to do it.

Thing owes me over $50k and it comes undone for what amounts to someone cutting  corners for the sake of it.

Just one thing after another..

the push rod shit is easy  you do not have to swap valve springs . it will take 5 minutes to do.

i need the push rod photos.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 06:30:53 pm by barnett468 »

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #773 on: March 26, 2016, 06:30:20 pm »
the push rod shit is easy  you do not have to swap valve springs.

The checking rods will bend at the thread with the springs on that motor I reckon I would put light ones in to make sure its right and the rockers are running in the centre of the valve

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #774 on: March 26, 2016, 06:34:39 pm »