Do you have to degree a new cam ?

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Author Topic: Do you have to degree a new cam ?  (Read 482865 times)

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #75 on: February 23, 2016, 09:13:40 am »
this is the $15,000.00 engine with the webers, but nothing makes since because he says dart boss heads and the dyno sheet says boss dart heads etc, but my guess is that it is the one you describe.

i found a good cam from crane and apd sells crane parts and there is a crane facility in oz or he can buy it in the US and ship.

i will post the info shortly on his Snausage scam and the crane cam and you wont believe what Snausage did.

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 09:17:24 am by barnett468 »

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #76 on: February 23, 2016, 09:31:25 am »
I'd just get a Comp HR extreme energy cam, custom ground of 110 or 108  rather then 112 centers and call it job done, something with around min 235 deg @ 50 that will be fine to mid 6's and be fatter in the mid range

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #77 on: February 23, 2016, 09:32:48 am »
I'd just get a Comp HR extreme energy cam, custom ground of 110 or 108  rather then 112 centers and call it job done, something with around min 235 deg @ 50 that will be fine to mid 6's and be fatter in the mid range

His Snausage cam has a whopping 114 lsa.


Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #78 on: February 23, 2016, 09:33:24 am »
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Fitzy . Post the number on the end of the cam . I can call Snausage and see what they did . I just talked to Snausage and they said they can make that grind with 3 different lobe/valve lifts, so yours could be any of those.


DART makes a 210 cc and a 225 cc Pro 1 aluminum head . Any idea if yours are one of these?

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 09:45:57 am by barnett468 »

Offline shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #79 on: February 23, 2016, 09:45:24 am »
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Fitzy . Post the number on the end of the cam . I can call Snausage and see what they did . I just talked to Snausage and they said they can make that grind with 3 different lobe/valve lifts, so yours could be any of those.

thats kind of like a blower cam LSA or injection.

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #80 on: February 23, 2016, 09:47:52 am »
Ok, i may have caused some confusion here so i apologize.


Ford racing Windsor 302 block (363ci)

11.5 Compression

Dart Pro 1 heads - Ported etc etc, not sure of exact specs

T&D shaft mount rockers - Not sure of specs, 1.70

Callies crank - Pretty sure it's a Magnum crank

Oliver rods - Not sure of specs

CP Pistons - Not sure of specs

Schneider Solid roller cam - not sure of specs until i pull the cam and get the serial number


I'll try and get the cam out over the next couple of days, have a few things on.


I'll measure the diff ratio and pipes.



I phoned the builder again this morning, there still looking for the paperwork etc only been 3 weeks now. So its all guess work at the moment which doesn't help any of you, i apologize.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 09:51:49 am by Fitzy1980 »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #81 on: February 23, 2016, 09:52:42 am »
thats kind of like a blower cam LSA or injection.

Yeah, I wouldn't use it, AND if it is their standard grind, it only has a pathetic .480" valve lift with 1.6 rockers, and the base DART 210 cc Pro 1 heads flow a purported 305 and 208 @ .600.

I seriously doubt [or seriously hope] that the engine builder didn't put a cam with only .480" lift in that thing, however, if they did, and Fitzy already thinks it's fast, just imagine the surprise he's gonna have with a real cam in there.




Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #82 on: February 23, 2016, 09:55:52 am »
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Hey, nothin to apologize for, take your time.

Maybe call the engine builder and ask them if they would have used a custom Snausage grind or if they just bought one out of the catalog . If it is out of their catalog, we already have the info.

Do you want to keep the solid roller?

If you have high valve spring pressures, the hydro lifters will cost you $700.00 usd . If you don't have high spring pressures, the lifters will cost you $350.00 plus shipping.

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 09:59:02 am by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #83 on: February 23, 2016, 10:04:10 am »
Alright these are rough OD measurements on the headers and exhaust with verniers.

Headers are 1.85 then out to 3" for about say 2 foot then expands out to 4-4.5" pipe about 1 foot long each then back down to 3" into the mufflers and 2.5" out the back

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #84 on: February 23, 2016, 10:08:06 am »
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YOUR HP NUMBERS FROM AN ENGINE DYNO OR REAR WHEEL DYNO?


Alright these are rough OD measurements on the headers and exhaust with verniers.

Headers are 1.85 then out to 3" for about say 2 foot then expands out to 4-4.5" pipe about 1 foot long each then back down to 3" into the mufflers and 2.5" out the back

Ok, that is totally retarded unless the headers have merge collectors or unless that big pipe is actually resonators.

Exactly what headers are they?

Do you have a cross over tube?

What mufflers do you have?

Are the mufflers straight thru?

If they don't have merge collectors, I would have a 3" pipe come off the header that will make the distance from where the 4 pipes go into 1 to the end of the extension around 18" . The extension is called a collector [not a merge collector] . Then have it taper down to 2 3/4 all the way back with straight thru Magnaflow mufflers.

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« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 10:22:24 am by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #85 on: February 23, 2016, 10:17:35 am »
Ok, that is totally retarded unless they have merge collectors.

Exactly what headers are they

Do you have a cross over tube?

what mufflers do you have?

are they straight thru?

I would have a 3" pipe come off the header that will make the distance from where the 4 pipes go into the


It was all custom, they don't do exhausts anymore and someone local who does all there cars and race cars does it.

After the headers the pipes bend inwards and meet just before the larger 4-4.5" pipes, i can't really tell if they actually merge into one another or are just tacked together unless i jack up the car.

The mufflers are Hurricane.

I'll get a photo of the system


I was thinking of going with a side exit system after all this is sorted anyway. But that's a story for another day.

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #86 on: February 23, 2016, 10:24:33 am »
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ARE YOUR HP NUMBERS FROM AN ENGINE DYNO OR REAR WHEEL DYNO?

ARE YOUR HEADS 210 OR 225 CC?


Side exhaust will be deafening.

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #87 on: February 23, 2016, 10:28:02 am »
YOUR HP NUMBERS FROM AN ENGINE DYNO OR REAR WHEEL DYNO?

Definitely wheel dyno

ARE YOUR HEADS 210 OR 225 CC?

I rang about 10 mins ago and left a message with the office person, sent them another email.

All i know for now is there PRO 1 CNC


Pissing me off now, it's over 3 weeks and multiple requests. Either they can't be assed or have no clue where it is.

Side exhaust will be deafening.

Yeah that was my main concern

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 10:35:54 am by Fitzy1980 »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #88 on: February 23, 2016, 11:01:05 am »
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Ok, all you need to do is measure the size of the intake port on the heads.

Either that cam has more lift than their stock one or that dyno is lying big time cuz you ain't gonna get that much power with only 230 duration @ .050 and only .480 valve lift.

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 11:03:52 am by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #89 on: February 23, 2016, 12:35:23 pm »
Right, just so im on the same page.

I'm rotating the engine till the 1st lifter on the left is all the way up, then keep rotating till it begins to move back down until i hit 0.

Yeah ?

I know i'm frustrating  :lmao:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #90 on: February 23, 2016, 12:55:22 pm »
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Nope, the first valve is the exhaust . The second is the intake.

Crank until the second valve back goes down then comes back up, then continue to rotate clockwise until you see marks on the damper and line 0 up with the pointer.

I have cam info . This will be fun.

.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 12:57:16 pm by barnett468 »

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #91 on: February 23, 2016, 12:59:59 pm »
Found the Dart head part number

13071020

Pro 1 CNC 210cc


Cam info i just got via email is

230 @ .50 int and exhaust

.365 lobe lift

110 LS



Do i have to remove all the webers from the manifold ? was hoping to leave them all on.

« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 01:12:55 pm by Fitzy1980 »

Offline lukep6470

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #92 on: February 23, 2016, 01:11:22 pm »
I know on my weber manifold it is soo much easier to pull the induction off the top to get at the two middle bolts on each side.   

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #93 on: February 23, 2016, 01:13:38 pm »
I know on my weber manifold it is soo much easier to pull the induction off the top to get at the two middle bolts on each side.


Ahh this is what i was just about to ask because they look like a mother to get at  :lmao:

 :cheers: :cheers:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #94 on: February 23, 2016, 01:16:00 pm »
Found the Dart head part number

13071020

Pro 1 CNC 210cc


Cam info i just got via email is

230 @ .50 int and exhaust

.365 lobe lift

110 LS

Do i have to remove all the webers from the manifold ? was hoping to leave them all on.

Ok, xlnt . I will post comparative cam info in less than 30 minutes.



Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #95 on: February 23, 2016, 02:14:48 pm »
All good, managed to get the 4 nuts off without taking the carbs off.  :pepper: :pepper:

Manifold is off.


Lifters are from shizer housen too Barn

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #96 on: February 23, 2016, 02:16:26 pm »

Lifters are from shizer housen too Barn

WTF?

 :lmao:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #97 on: February 23, 2016, 02:17:26 pm »
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Do you mean Snausage Housen?

Offline trav68

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #98 on: February 23, 2016, 02:36:28 pm »
That lobe lift (0.365 x 1.7 = 0.620 ) sounds more relevant to this engine/dyno numbers than the 0.480 someone mentioned above.....

Offline Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #99 on: February 23, 2016, 02:50:42 pm »
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Do you mean Snausage Housen?

 :thumb:


My main concern is compatibility with the existing engine. I'd like to avoid having to switch to different lifters, springs, etc etc.

New cam, back together, tune and  :burnout: :burnout: